ship's arguments, for these made against the Chiltern hundreds, for the purpose of his own proposition. He said, that a vacating his seat [A laugh]. He had no great mass of evidence was to be pro- objection to take that office, if the learned duced, and the inference was, that it ought gent. also would take it, and bring his po to be produced early, on account of the pularity to the test by facing him on the

hustings in Covent-garden [A laugh].

length of time which the business would occupy. All the witnesses were here; it Mr. Perceval said, that instead of forcing was not necessary to send for them to a this matter forward on a former night, he distance, as in country cases. The parties had expressly abstained from agitating it, ought to have considered before, what evi- on the ground of the absence of the right dence they had to produce, and not now hon. gent. The noble lord (H. Petty) be coming to the house to gain time to had, however, ingeniously put into his hunt out more. But when his lordship mouth the expressions now brought forplaced the matter on the footing of a mis- ward by the right hou. gent., but he had take of his own, he would not, out of compli- disclaimed them. He had, however, no hesiment to him, or any other gentleman, tation now, nor at any time, to answer for

move any opposition. He understood from him, that he had presented the petition earlier than the petitioners wished; but as to the observation about the balloting, if it had come out of the glass the fifth instead of the fourth, it would only have made a difference of three or four days;

what he did say. The expression, the wit of which the right hon. gent. described as equal to its candour, arose from the accident of his having seen the right hon. gent. parading the streets in a sort of triumphal car, decorated with laurels-[aloud laugh]. The hon. gent.had said, that it was contrary

so that there was nothing in that argument, to his practice to adhere to his opinions. But though the question was now respect- That was an accusation that came rather ing delay, he believed that the next notice oddly from the right hon. gent., and those of the noble lord would be, that we were who sat with him on the other side of the to hear no more of this petition. They house. With respect to himself, he was seemed to have employed very judicious not aware of any such deficiency in adhering counsel, who had, in considering the cir- to his opinions as the right hon. gent. imcumstances, advised them to delay it, and puted to him. Certainly his opinions on fix it for the very time when these counsel the subject now before the house had underwould be on the circuit. This would gone no change, and he saw no reason to afford an excuse for further delay, which, change them. With respect to the right out of compliment to these judicious gen-hon. gent.'s challenge to meet him on the tlemen, he could not of course oppose. hustings in Covent Garden, he had to excuse

He would take this occasion to advert to something that had fallen from a learned gentleman opposite (Mr. Perceval) on a former day, in his absence.- [Hear! hear! from Mr. Perceval.] He was happy to hear this challenge from the learned gentleman, particularly as it was a proof that he con

himself, on the ground that he had constituents who had shewn him uniform favour since they had returned him to the first parliament he had sat in. These constituents he was attached to, and was unwilling to desert them for the ambition of representing any greater place. The right

tinued in the same mind on this subject, hon. gent. had at times spoken of a similar which was not his general practice. The attachment, though he had afterwards learned gentleman had talked a great deal found it so easy to get rid of it. At least, of his, want of popularity, and had observed, with a degree of wit correspondent with its candour, that it was not till the government horses had been yoked to his car that he had been brought in. Now, tic. It was easy to credit an excuse of

though his majesty had thought him worthy to hold an office of trust and emolument, he was bold to think, whatever the learned gentleman and some few other clamorous persons might pretend to the contrary, that his claim to public support was not thereby lessened. There was a sort of report that he was about to take another office, namely,

such was the amount of what was represented in the news-papers, in the right hon. gent.'s name. But, perhaps, what was thus stated on the subject, was not authen

that kind from the extravagancies contained in the speeches imputed to the right hon. gentleman.

Mr. Sheridan said, that when he stood for Westminster, it was with the full permission of the electors of Stafford [a laugh]. It was not, however, the severity of the learned gent.'s remarks that he complained of, but the prejudice they were calculated the 5th of February; but, after a few reto cast on a contested election, on which marks from the speaker and lord H. Petty.

the learned gent. himself might be called to sit as a judge. The triumphal car and the procession which had excited the spleen of the learned gent., was, he would venture to say, one of the most popular triumphs that had ever been witnessed in this or in any other city. [A laugh.]

Lord Folkestone said, that he had not been aware of the circumstance with respect to the circuit, and that it certainly would be necessary to accommodate the counsel. The motion was then agreed to.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Monday, December 29.

the hon. gent, withdrew his motion, and the 3d of February was fixed for the consideration of this petition. - A petition from certain electors of Norfolk, in the interest of Mr. Wodehouse, was laid on the table. This petition was read. It charged the candidates who were returned, Messrs. Coke and Windham, with having been guilty of treating, &c. Ordered to be taken into consideration on the 5th of February. -Lord Howick, adverting to what he had stated on a former day relative to the means of facilitating the progress of private bills, observed, that he had since consulted with those who were competent to form a correct opinion upon that subject, and that he should the next day move, that the house do make an order that, after fixing the time within which private petitions should be presented, the house should occupy itself until half after four o'clock each day in receiving the reports of private committees, and in forwarding private business.

(NAVY ESTIMATES.] Mr. T. Grenville moved, that the house should resolve itself into a committee of supply. Upon the speaker's leaving the chair, there was a general cry of "Mr. Hobhouse to the chair!" That hon. gent. accordingly took his seat at the table, and is therefore considered as chairman of the committees of supply and ways and means.

[MINUTES.] Upon the motion of Mr. Swan, the consideration of the petition relative to the Penrhyn Election was discharged, and fixed for the 29th of January. The consideration of a petition from the hon. Wm. Ponsonby, relative to the county of Londonderry Election, was fixed for the same day. -Two petitions were presented complaining of the return for Horsham, and they were appointed for consideration upon the same day as that fixed for the petition already before the house respecting the said election. - A petition from Mr. T. Jones against the Return for Shrewsbury was laid upon the table; and upon the speaker's moving, that it should be considered on the first vacant day, namely, the 3d of February, Mr. Johnstone, understanding that further Mr. T. Grenville (first lord of the admitime was required for the accommodation ralty) then rose. He said, that from the of the parties to this petition, proposed situation which he now held, it became his the 14th of February. The speaker felt it his duty to submit to the consideration of the duty to observe, that the proposed post-committee the necessary Naval Supplies ponement would be a departure from the proposed to be granted to his majesty. general practice of the house in such ca- There being no particular circumstances ses; the earliest vacant day being uniform- in the Estimates which he deemed necessaly fixed upon in the first instance: and if ry to lay before the committee, that difany farther postponement were afterwards fered from those of the preceding year, he required, it was generally the practice of did not deem it necessary to detain the the house to accede to it, upon special committee with any preliminary observa

cause being assigned. Having stated the tions. He should confine himself entirely practice on such occasions, it was of course to stating, that what he had to propose to for the discretion of the house to deter- the house, as to the number of men to mine upon the course to be pursued in this serve in his majesty's navy, and the expence instance. Some conversation arose upon attending them, was precisely the same as this point, in which lord Howick, lord H. had been voted last year. But although Petty, and Mr. Bennet, one of the parties he declined making any observations at interested in the petition, took a part, and present, he should of course avail himself concurred in the propriety of the speaker's of his right to reply to any remarks that objections; Mr. Bennet observing, that might be offered upon this subject. the proposed delay would interfere with right hon. gent. concluded with moving the assizes.. Mr. Johnstone then proposed the following resolutions, which were agreed

The

[238 to; viz. 1. "That it is the opinion of this ing of the late elections for Plymouth, committee, that 120,000 men be employed Maidstone, Dublin, and Chippenham, which

for the sea service for the year 1807, including 29,000 royal marines. 2. That a sum, not exceeding 2,886,000l., be granted to his majesty, for wages of the said 120,000 men for 13 months, at the rate of 11. 17s. per man per month. 3. That a sum, not exceeding 2,964,000l., be granted to his majesty, for victuals for the said 120,000 men for 13 months, at the rate of 11. 18s. per man per month. 4. That a sum, not exceeding 4,680,000/., be granted to his majesty, for the wear and tear of the ships in which the said 120,000 men are to serve, for 13 months, at the rate of 31. per man per month. 5. That a sum, not exceeding 390,000/., be granted to his majesty, for ordnance for sea service on board the ships in which the said 120,000 men are to serve, for 13 months, at the rate of 5s. per man per month."-The house then resumed, and the report was ordered to be brought up the next day.

HOUSE OF COMMONS.

Tuesday, December 30.

[MINUTES.] Mr. Raine gave notice that he should, on Friday next, move for leave to bring in a bill to explain and amend two acts, the 2d of Richard II. and the 32d of Henry VIII. for the preventing of any man of law from acting as a justice of assize in his own county. These acts imposed a penalty of 100%. for every instance in which their provisions were departed frorn, and the object of the measure he meant to propose, would be to render their operation more effectual.. Mr. Corry trusted that due care would be taken to prevent the measure from operating any change in the law as it at present stands in that part of the united kingdom called Ireland, until it should be ascertained that such change was desirable. There existed several acts of the Irish parliament upon this subject, to which he begged leave to direct the attention of the learned gent. before he brought forward his measure. At any rate, he thought it would. be desirable for the learned gent, to defer his motion, until there should be an opportunity of consulting the Irish govern

were severally ordered to be taken into consideration on the following days: the Plymouth petition on the 5th of February; Maidstone and Dublin petitions on the 10th of February; and the Chippenham petition on the 12th of February, on which day a petition from several burgesses of Chippenham, was also ordered to be taken into consideration. - The house went into a committee on the act for regulating the Leather trade, and, on the motion of lord Temple, agreed to a resolution, that the chairman do ask leave to bring in a bill to repeal so much of the said act as prohibits the regrating of Oak Bark, and to indemnify certain persons who had incurred penalties for regrating oaken bark. Lord Temple stated, that the whole of the Tanning trade was carried on with bark purchased of persons who bought to sell again. This had been prohibited under a penalty by the act referred to the committee; but the act was never put in force; and it was not until last year that some informers had brought qui tam actions to recover the penalties incurred under the act, that it had been found necessary to repeal it. Last session, he had brought in an act to suspend the prosecutions, and as the business of the trade could not be carried on, without permitting the regrating of Oak Bark, he then proposed, that that part of the bill which prohibited this practice, should be repealed. The house then resumed, and Mr. Hobhouse, the chairman, obtained leave to bring in the bill.

[DISTILLATION OF SUGAR.] Lord Temple rose pursuant to notice, to move that a committee be appointed to consider of the possibility, and, if possible, of the propriety of permitting Sugar and Molasses to be used in Distilleries and Breweries. In making this motion, it was not his intention to pledge either himself or the house to the measure. He wished at present only that a committee should be appointed to enquire into the subject, leaving it open to the house to take such proceeding hereafter as the circumstances of the case, should be found to require. In

ment and law officers, how far the measure the present situation of affairs, the circumcould be applied to Ireland. - After a stances of the continental nations must short conversation between Mr. Raine and necessarily bear hard on many branches of Mr. Corry, the former wi.hdrew his no-commerce, but on none more heavily tice for the present, in order to allow time than upon our West-India trade. It was for obtaining every information on the sub- ascertained that there were at present in ject.-Petitions were presented, complain- the port of London alone, between 80 and

90,000 hogsheads of Sugar upon hand. measure to be brought forward, no prediThe quantity in the same situation in the lection would be shewn for any one class of ont-ports was proportionably great: so landed proprietors. The committee which that the Sugars on hand in the whole had sat last session, had thrown much light of England amounted to 150 or 160,000 upon the subject, and he trusted, therefore, hogsheads. This statement alone would be that the whole of the case would be atsufficient to convince the house of the tended to in the present instance. He had propriety of taking some measures for the thought it necessary to say thus much, in relief of so important a branch of the na-order that the house should not be consitional commerce. It might not be amiss dered as pledged to the measure, from the here to state, that it was not in contempla- circumstance of this early stage of the tion to submit any proposition for the in- business passing without any observation troduction of sugar and molasses into upon it. -The committee was appointed breweries and distilleries, to the exclusion accordingly. of grain. The object was to allow the use [WOOLLEN TRADE.] Lord Temple, purof them upon principles of fair competi- suant to notice, begged leave to call the tion, not of exclusion. All the parties attention of the house to the state of the too, whose interests might be concerned, Woollen Manufacture of the country, and whether brewers, distillers, or others, would of the laws relating to that important subhave an opportunity of making out their ject. A committee had been appointed cases before the committee. Having pre- last session to consider of the matter, and mised thus much, the noble lord concluded had taken a large mass of evidence upon by moving, "That a committee be ap- every part of the case. It had been the pointed to consider of the expediency of intention of the gentlemen who promoted permitting the use of Sugar and Molasses that enquiry, to follow up the investigation in the Distillery and Brewery, for a time to by some legislative measure, which might be limited, under the circumstances now provide some remedy for all the inconaffecting the trade of the British colonies veniences resulting from the operation of in the West Indies; and to report the same, the statutes then in existence. The diswith their observations and opinions thereon, to the house."

Mr. Dent expressed an earnest wish, that

solution of parliament, however, by precluding the house from instituting any proceeding upon a report of the committee of

this important subject should not be another parliament, had made it necessary hastily decided upon, but that sufficient to take up the business anew. The course time should be afforded for a mature con- he proposed to follow, therefore, was to sideration of all the great interests con-move that the laws relating to the Woollen rected with it. Manufactures be referred to a committee,

Lord Temple was disposed to afford all and also the report of the committee of last the parties whose interests might be con- session. Upon the report of this comcerned, a full opportunity of being heard, mittee, the house would found the ulterior and it was with that view that he had measure that was necessary for the interest adopted the mode he had just propo- of this important branch of our manufacsed, of appointing a committee before tures. From communications which he which all such parties might be heard. But had had with the parties most interested, from the circumstances he had stated, it he had the satisfaction to state that they would be obvious that some immediate re-did not propose to bring forward any fresh lief was necessary, and that his object evidence, but were prepared to rest upon would be defeated by any considerable the case they had made out last session. delay. He expected, therefore, that the question

Mr. Baker hoped that those gentlemen would be brought to issue in the present who proposed to bring forward this mea- session. But whatever pleasure he should sure, would consider well what effect it feel in bringing it to a satisfactory termimight have on the value of lands and the nation, he was not disposed to object to interests of agriculture in this country. hearing any further evidence, which might He was aware that there might be many be thought essential. It was his wish that circumstances which would require of the all the parties interested should be fully legislature to attend particularly to particu- heard, if they had not felt that the case as lar branches of the property and trade of made out before the former committee was the country; but he did hope that, in the fully sufficient. The several laws relating to the Woollen Manufactures, and the re-lit was very material that the whole of it port of the committee of last session thereon, were then, on the motion of lord Temple, referred to a committee.

[NEGOCIATION WITH FRANCE.] Mr. Perceval rose for the purpose of putting one or two questions to the noble lord opposite (lord Howick), on the subject of the papers then in the hands of the members

should be produced. Another point on which he desired to be informed, was whe ther lord Yarmouth had received any communication from Mr. Fox, or from any of his majesty's ministers, previous to his first leaving France; also the date of that noble lord's communication with M. Talleyrand; together with the date of his leaving Paris,

of the house, with a view to obtain infor-and of his arrival in London. The first mation upon certain points, which appeared communication from lord Yarmouth to to him to require to be further elucidated. Mr. Secretary Fox certainly appeared dated He wished to put the questions to the noble the 13th of July, but he wished to know lord, because the answers he might receive, whether that was the date when the dis

might perhaps render it unnecessary for him to give any notice of a motion on the subject, and it might also happen, that the noble lord, when infornied of the points to which his enquiries were directed, might not have any objection to accede to such

patch was addressed to Mr. Fox, or when it was drawn up. The next point related to a statement in an official note presented by lord Lauderdale to gen. Clarke, dated Aug. 6, " that intervening circumstances, which it was unnecessary to detail, had en

to his Sicilian majesty." He wished to know what those efforts had been, and whether there were any documents to shew

motion as should be necessary, in order to abled his majesty to enter into a separate come at the information he required, in the treaty." Now, it did not appear upon the most satisfactory manner. He should, face of the Papers what these circumstances therefore, state the points on which he were, and he wished to be informed rethought information necessary, and be specting them. Another question he wishguided by the answers he should receive, ed to ask, grew out of a passage in the disas to the course he should ultimately adopt. patch of the 10th of September, from the The first point upon which he wished to be right hon.gent. opposite (Mr.Windham) to informed, related to an extraordinary in- lord Lauderdale. The passage was, "every terpolation, which appeared in the letter effort was made at the outset of the negofrom M. Talleyrand to Mr. Secretary Fox, ciation to obtain the restitution of Naples dated April 1, as published by the French government, when compared with the letter of the same date in the official papers on the table (p. 95.) He wished to know whe- that they had been made, and whether ther there had been a passage similar to there would be any objection to lay before that extraordinary interpolation in any the house the details of the reasons for deletter received by Mr. Fox from M. Tal-parting from that claim, as said in that disleyrand, and also whether any answer had patch to be detailed in the correspondence been returned by Mr. Fox to that letter. of the foreign office, with lords Yarmouth The next object of the information he de-and Lauderdale. "The last question he had sired was the letter No. 3, from M. Tal-to put, related to the communication made leyrand, dated March 5, as it appeared in by lord Lauderdale to M. Talleyrand, stathe papers before the house. This was ting that he was authorized to negociate evidently an extract from the letter re- also for Russia on the same terms as had

been communicated to M. Talleyrand by his excellency count Budberg. It did not appear on the face of the papers what these terms were; and on an occasion in which the house was to be called on to decide upon the merits of the negociation and the rupture of it, he felt that it was absolutely necessary that they should be put in pos

ceived by Mr. Fox, and it struck him that it would be extremely desirable, previous to the discussion of the papers, that the house should be in possession of the whole of this document. Of this he was so convinced, that if the noble lord should not be prepared to produce the document to the house, he should feel it his duty to make a specific motion upon the subject, reser-session of the terms upon which it was

proposed to treat.

ving his reasons until he should come to make the motion. This letter, he was Lord Howick said, he was most willing aware, was a private one; but as it had been made the channel of communication upon the relations of the two countries, VOL. VIII,

to give every explanation on the subject of any part of the papers that were to be dis cussed on Monday, which might be thought

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